Helping Kids Find Their Place w/ Abish Israde & Judge Kathleen Feeney

What helps a kid feel like they truly belong? 

In this episode, Judge Kathleen Feeney and Abish Israde (Wedgwood Wraparound Program) join Hillary to explore how one trusted adult can make all the difference in a child’s life—and why a sense of belonging is essential for emotional and social well-being.

Hear stories from the courtroom and the community, along with practical strategies for parents, caregivers, and educators to help kids feel seen, supported, and connected.

Whether you're guiding a child through tough seasons or just looking to build stronger relationships, this episode is filled with hope, encouragement, and action steps to help kids find their place.

For more information on the podcast, please visit: https://www.wedgwood.org/podcast/

For information on counseling, please visit: https://www.wedgwood.org/counseling/

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Transcript

Hillary: 0:00

Hey, it's Hillary. Join me for a helpful and hopeful chat about mental health in our community. So grab a cup of coffee or tea. This is Wedgwood's Coffee Break conversation.

Unknown: 0:12

I'm Kathleen Feeney. I've been a judge here in Kent County for 25 years. For 22 years, I spent a lot of time doing divorce, custody, child support, paternity, abuse and neglect, delinquency, personal protection, order, adoption cases. And now I'm at the court of appeals. I tell people, for those 22 years, it was as if I had the striped shirt on running up and down the field making the call in those cases. And now I am up in the instant replay booth, and there's 25 of us, and we sit in panels of three, and we review everything that's gone in the case, and then we affirm the ruling that the trial court made, or we reverse the ruling on the field. And it's been tremendous. I've really been enjoying it. Great. Thank you. My name is avicizrade. I've been here at Wedgwood for closer to nine years now, currently I'm working as a wraparound supervisor within our counseling integrated department. But before then, I did have experience as a as a wraparound coordinator. And even before then, it's still, you know, my passion has been integrating youth and families in their community. I did after school programming with our youth enhancement program back in the day as well.

Hillary: 1:21

Nice. So before we launch into this conversation, I'd love to hear a little bit about why you are so passionate about the well being of kids and families, and what got you into your work.

Unknown: 1:33

When you are dealing with families who come before the court, it's a lot of different perspectives, whether their kids caught in the middle of their parents' divorce, or their parents are never married, but they're not agreeing on how they're going to spend their time with their parents. Or it's juveniles who make bad choices, and we want to help them make better choices, or children who are part of the Child Protective area. These kids didn't choose any of this, we need to give them the resources and the encouragement and the ability to say, Okay, this is not going to define me. This is not what my life is going to be all about. This is a part of my life, and I need help getting through it and figuring out a way to thrive despite all of this. And how can you say no? How can you say no to that? Because there's so much potential and so much excitement and energy and the dreams that they have, and you just want to say, Okay, we're doing everything we can. We're rolling up our sleeves. Here we go. What do you need? How can we help you? What can we do to encourage you? How can we help you make better choices? Because we know your brain isn't fully developed until you're like 24 or 26 and there's going to be mistakes. Great. Let's use them for learning opportunities, so it just kind of builds on itself. And these kids, they they need so much and they deserve so much. And when you have an opportunity like we have to reach out to them and work with them. There is nothing that's better.

Hillary: 3:01

I love that.

Unknown: 3:03

Yeah. Similarly, you know, we as the in the wraparound program, we work with a lot of youth that find themselves in situations where they've given up hope, or even their parents or caregivers have similarly given up hope on them. And so my passion, what I love doing, is really encouraging that hope, again, instilling a sense of belonging, and again, the ability to move forward from obstacles that you know, sometimes youth like you said, don't have much to do take part in right? And so knowing, okay, you have a system of support here that can help you, you know, go forth and maintain your goals. Yeah, that's

Hillary: 3:42

great. So I read recently that nearly half of kids don't feel a strong sense of belonging in their schools, which is really sad to hear. Is this what you're seeing in your circles and in your work? Do most kids feel like they don't fit in

Unknown: 3:56

absolutely it's amazing. I think COVID really did a huge disservice to our kids. Obviously, it did a huge disservice to everybody, but the fact that they couldn't go to school, they couldn't make those connections, and school is where you do so much of that social, emotional learning piece. You learn to read cues, you learn to communicate. So what did our kids do? They had to sit behind screens, be more isolated, be more on their own and then relying so much more on their phones, and those sorts of things where we know a lot of not very nice things happen, a lot of cyber bullying and things like that. And it's just, I think it's been really, really hard for our kids. The Kids these days are extremely anxious, and lots of them are very depressed because of things going on in the world, because of things that happen within their family. Their parents are losing their job, or they got to move, or somebody who dies, or whatever that it is, but they have so much on their plate right now, and they're trying to deal with so much, you know, the world is getting warm, or there's not going to be any hope for the future. And so these. Kids, really, they become very isolated and very withdrawn. And the studies all show that having kids at school gives them that opportunity to find the resources the teachers who are going to help get an IEP or a 504 if they need assistance with that. And just by being connected to one person, just one person at the school. It can be a teacher, it can be a social worker, it can be the school lunch lady, or it can be the school librarian or the custodian, or a coach or an assistant coach, somebody who expects to see them there, finds joy from interacting with them. That gets our kids to come to school, and so they can hopefully make up for some of those that lost opportunity to learn those social interaction skills that'll keep them engaged and and hopeful. Yeah, man, I think you said everything to a T right there within our program, we're seeing a lot of kiddos express an interest in and being included in belonging and finding a social circle for themselves, and it's it's really our part, you know, as adults, you know, as caregivers, as supports, to guide them, like you said to the to the right people that can really help them explore their interests, but also follow through with them. I think that's something that I really do appreciate from my program, is not only are we pointing them to the right direction, right we're making sure that they feel supported even after that, that their caregivers also feel supported in keeping their kid engaged in this type of program or in whatever goals they have themselves as caregivers too.

Hillary: 6:37

So let's talk about this idea of belonging a little bit from your perspectives, what does it mean for a child to feel a sense of belonging? And then on the flip side, what are some signs that a kid might be struggling with feeling like they don't fit in or have a place in this world?

Unknown: 6:52

I think the belonging is that that there's people who care for them and care about them, that they feel like they are connected, whether it's to other adults or other youth, because it's that desire for connection that kind of feeds our basic needs, right? What's it Maslow's hierarchy of needs, exactly, exactly, and what happens when that doesn't occur? It's isolation, it's depression. It is not wanting to be involved in anything. It is a lot of kids who then seek to deal with that loss of the dopamine by using substances or sitting behind their screens and doom scrolling and and not engaging. We see that a lot kids not going to school. That's one of the big things, too. So so

Hillary: 7:43

when they feel like they don't belong somewhere, they kind of write it off, like, I don't need to be there. Then,

Unknown: 7:50

yeah, yeah. I think we see a lot of kiddos write it off like you say, and also just completely, even, you know, stop believing in their own, you know, abilities and that as well, like, yes, they wrote it off, that, that particular opportunity. But then, you know, what I hate seeing in youth too, is that okay, I'm not going to take part of anything else, right? And it's that sense of hopeless that just kind of snowballs and turns into those, those isolation factors that you know you mentioned, I think something else that I see too is in in a kiddos need to feel accepted. They sometimes join different, you know, not as healthy circles, right? Or they turn it into behaviors that get them into more trouble, right? So we want to make sure that the circles that they are in are positive ones, right? That they're in it, you know, because they themselves, their identities are being, are being filled and and not expressed in another, different way, yeah, I think with identities too, so much of the LGBTQ plus community, those kids especially, are at risk. I heard one time that we have at any point in time, 2200 homeless youth wandering around Kent County at any point in time. It's probably larger than that, because that wasn't from several years ago, and a huge percentage of those kids are LGBTQ plus. And it just breaks my heart that these kids, who probably need our support more than ever, especially now, are out there floating around and being taken advantage of. I mean, we have the Manasa project, which deals with human trafficking, and I wish they were out of business, but they're not, and they're thriving. And I have kids who are recruiting other kids. When I say I have kids, I should always mention this, not my own children, but they're my kids, right? Yeah, I have kids who are recruiting other kids to work in these organizations, and it makes them feel like they're part of something they get in with. These promises, and then all of a sudden, everything turns bad, and they don't know how to pull themselves out of it. And it's just it's so dangerous, and we see kids making choices that they should never have to make or never want to make, because they just need to survive. And we need to get our kids beyond just surviving. And you mentioned just, you know, children wandering, right? Whether they be part of the LGBT community or other marginalized groups, right? They're wondering now, right? But how were they, you know, in high school, did we? Did they have a supportive hand back then to kind of guide them? And is, this is kind of the cusp, right? You see homeless youth, right? But you know, we also need to see those signs of of a kid, you know, faltering in their social groups or at school too, and catch it there.

Hillary: 10:49

And I think when you're talking about the Manasseh project and our and human trafficking and falling into the wrong circles, I think that's a good example of how strongly kids want to belong, because they will even be okay with joining something or being a part of something that they probably, deep down, know is not good or healthy for them, but they just want to belong more than they want to be safe or healthy or different, right? Yeah, we

Unknown: 11:16

have a kid right now in our wraparound program that is on juvenile probation, and it's because he's stealing items and and he's giving it to these circles, and him stealing and giving these items, it's him thinking, Okay, we're I'm part of this circle. I want their acceptance, right? But there has to be another way.

Hillary: 11:35

Why? Why do you think it's so important and then so hard for kids to feel like they belong.

Unknown: 11:44

It's important because it's part of their social development, right? You you learn, you learn how to parent from your parents, right? And so many kids that we have who are either homeless or their family dynamic was impacted by trauma. I mean, we see generational trauma that goes back 345, generations, and they can't seem to get out of that cycle. So we try to help kids realize that, okay, just because this happened to you doesn't mean that you're a bad person or that this is the way it's supposed to be. But we can make strides beyond that, the dynamics just are so difficult for these kiddos, and we need wraparound services. We need the community services, you know, the Wedgwood's, the Bethany Christian Services, the Catholic Social Services, the, you know, samaritas. We need all those folks pulling together for our kids.

Hillary: 12:43

So how can we help? How do we foster an environment of inclusion and support for kids?

Unknown: 12:51

Man, I think it's it's providing a listening ear. It's being cued in to those signs that kids are giving. You're not gonna be. They're never gonna be once to outright tell you, I need help in this, you know, I'm sure there are kids like that, but, you know, I know, growing up, me myself, I was really dependent on someone in my corner, knowing, like, hey, when I needed help and when I was crying out for for that assistance. And, you know, again, following through with it, you know, because that's that's to me, how you know or someone does actually care. It's not just you know them pointing you to a resource and dismissing you know, it's following through and making sure that you're doing okay. And if there's anything else that they could be more of a help with just a relationship, yeah, creating a relationship. But that's why I think that we have to kind of think of it. I think of it in terms of, like, three eyes. So you want to invite kids into your space, or invite yourself into their space, whether it's kids you see at work or on your church or in your family or in your neighborhood that seem to be falling between the cracks at school, whether school has or outreach for that, and invite them in. You know, do you want to go to a ball game? Do you want to come over for lunch? Do you want to go get a coffee or something like that? Go to frosty boy, which is open now and and, you know, and kind of get to know them and then find out what inspires them, right? You know, what do you like? Do you like sports? You know, we could go to a game. Do you like art? Oh my gosh, there's so much art in this community. Do you like going fishing? We could do that and just try to kind of figure out what feeds them. It's kind of like figuring out their love language, right? Which is really, really important, because then they know that you're interested in them, and how can the two of you connect? And then imagine, okay, how can we take you your interest in these things, and imagine how we can get you connected to the larger community. Can we get you involved in a choir, if you love to sing, can we get you involved in, like, a cooking class? They have great cooking classes. Community College, or chef Jenna up at amore, she does that all the time. Art they have stuff at Grand Rapids Art Museum all the time for free. Can we do that? Can we go to a ball game? Can we go hiking? What about dogs? Do you like dogs? Let's go. We can volunteer at the Humane Society. And it's just those sorts of things, because truly it is having one adult in your life who can be your forever adult. I went to a thing, and I can't remember the name of the program, but he was from New York, and it was a program called you've got to believe his name was Pat. And he said every person out there, especially kids that are aging out of foster care, they need a permanent adult. It doesn't mean that you have to adopt them, but it has to be somebody that they can always call. My car broke down. Can you help me? I'm in jail. Can you come and bail me out? I need some grocery money. Can you do this? And it was all about having that person as your permanent adult, and it made all the sense in the world, because so many kids who age out of foster care and who have been in the system for forever end up getting not going to college, getting involved in criminal activity, not meeting their full potential. So we want to be able to provide them with those connections. So kind of you know, inviting those kids to join your life, finding out what their interests are imagining how we can get them reconnected to the community. We all have that opportunity. We all have a superpower to do that. And we all have the superpower of kindness, which I wish everybody would exercise. Yeah, so I think that's one of the pillars with wraparound that I do really like, is fostering those natural supports, or those more creative supports it on the community. It's super easier, easy for me to put on my case management hat and say, okay, Arbor circle has this. We at Wedgwood have this. You know, go connect to your school. But like you say, Judge Feeney, it's really creating an interest. Inventory with a with a kiddo, see what they are passionate about, what they are inspired about, and then sometimes they already have that connection in their own families or in their communities already, and it's inviting the kiddos to see that person in a different light and a different perspective, so they can able, you know, to reach out and connect to more resources out in the

Hillary: 17:13

community. So how do community supports and services help kids build connections and feel secure? And then what sort of role does the court system play in helping kids find stability and belonging?

Unknown: 17:26

Well, I'll let you know the first part. So I think community supports allow a kid, a family, to feel confident in the community around them, to know that they have support and have a person or a group of individuals that can help them in whatever area of need, that they can go to them in a time of need and say, like, you say like, it's a person that may not know everything, but it's a trusted person that can do the research with you and kind of struggle bust it with, yeah, you know to emphasize and empathize with you in that moment and help you get to a better spot. I think that's a sense of community. It's, it's, it's, there's no definition on how I think experience that community member has to be, but again, it has to be someone that has kindness and has that tenacity to make sure that the person that they're working with gets to a better

Hillary: 18:26

spot in life. I feel like I hear the phrase it takes a village a lot around when people have babies, you know, when new moms newborns. But that extends past that stage into the rest of your life too. It does take a village kind of get through life together.

Unknown: 18:40

Yeah, no, I think of even like young adults, you know, they're babies in the world, you know. I think of high school teaching you, you know, all your core fundamentals and you know, but like you, in that high school age of kiddos, they also need people to help them through those, those social situations, too, that they, you know, are crying out for. I keep telling people, even though, you know, we watch kids in college, their brains still aren't fully fun, fully developed, yeah, and so there's just, you know, whether you're watching babies on the football field or babies on the basketball field or softball or golf or whatever it is, they're still all babies. So I'm sorry, a bit bumped into that with respect to the court system, though, we are, I think, uniquely able to engage kids. So for example, in our juvenile delinquency cases, we have community probation officers. So our probation officers are in the community. You shouldn't have to go more than a mile from wherever you live to get to a center where the probation officer is and they'll contact you in your school, at your home, those sorts of things, and then they're able to be connected with the police in that area, with the schools in that area, with the people in the area and the resources so they can connect their kids who have made some bad choices and are in court with us, into those services with. Respect to the child neglect cases, abuse and neglect cases, when they come into court, then we have case managers. We have a whole group of people. We have attorneys who are representing them, and if the attorneys think that they need another attorney to represent what the kids want versus what their best interests are, we have another attorney there. We have attorneys representing the parents, and we're all trying to pull together to make sure that that family has all the services that they need, because we want to reunify them in a healthy manner. So we're doing everything we can. Sometimes, I hate to say this, but sometimes the judges, the lawyers, the probation officers, we're the most stable people that they have in their lives, and that's really quite sad, but at least we're stable people, and we have kids, we have court appointed special advocates to our CASAS are amazing, but sometimes the attorneys are the one who get the call I'm someplace I can't get home. It's two o'clock in the morning. Will you come pick me up? And the attorney will go pick them up. I'm doing this. This is what's happening. Or, you know, I've just decided I'm pregnant. What do I do now? And so we can be resources for them. So the court tries to support as much as we can with respect to providing guidance, providing assistance, providing resources, connecting them with resources, helping them make good choices, celebrating when we have successes, yeah, encouraging them when we have failures that okay, this isn't going to define you. We can move beyond this. Let's What lessons have we learned? And let's get going again. So it's, it's a it's a privilege to be able to work with families when they're at the crossroads that oftentimes our families are at, and sometimes they're in and out, because they learn the lesson really quickly, and sometimes I have the same people for 10 or 15 years. So,

Hillary: 21:45

but then how cool on? I'll use cool loosely, I suppose, how cool that you are still there. You are still you and your team are still there, supporting them, even all those years later, too. That is a real sense of stability.

Unknown: 21:58

Yes, yes. And I still have people calling from my cases from before. So, like, I'm like, just down the street.

Hillary: 22:05

That's nice, yeah? So this goes beyond kids, right? Like, I mean us adults, we want to feel like we belong and fit in too. So how do we help kids find belonging when we are also still looking for a sense of belonging?

Unknown: 22:20

Yeah, I something that I always encourage our wraparound caregivers is just modeling through the hardships, right? I think of so many times I wanted to reach out to a particular rock climbing, you know, course, that I want to do downtown, but I feel hesitant because I don't think, oh, I don't belong, you know, I haven't I've been so out of shape for a while, like, how could I be successful in this? But I think kiddos need to know that their parents kind of have that same hesitations too, you know, but they're willing to work through it and kind of take that first step forward in a direction that they know is hard, but at the end, it's going to be such a great, you know, life involvement there too. It's a good reminder

Hillary: 23:00

that, like us as adults, we don't have to have it all together. Have it all together to show kids. Well, we can. We can struggle with things too, but it's the fact that we try, yeah, we work on it

Unknown: 23:09

and and I think being willing to tell your kids that you're sorry, I don't remember hearing that when I was growing up and being able to tell my kids I'm sorry and that I've made mistakes, and I'm hoping that we can learn and move forward, I think is really huge for kids, because they realize that, wow, mistakes and learning from those mistakes that happens even later in life. Yeah, if I can say that, yeah, and finding ways to reconnect with your kids. So I was always involved in sports. I did competitive sports, starting when I was five, because I had two older brothers, and I did everything that they did, and scholarships to go and play in college and things like that. And so I always thought, oh, that's going to be what I'm going to connect with my kids. Yes, no. So after they got done with the little stuff. It's like, Oh, I was gonna go to high school basketball games and swim meets and things like that. We did that for a little while, but not in high school. And it's like, okay, well, we're gonna go to Comic Cons. We're gonna do, you know, get dressed up and go to see, to eat, to and do art things and and it's wonderful. But you just have to kind of meet your kids where they are and help them to realize that you are kind of the product of your upbringing. And you know, none of it was perfect, and we can all find things that we love together, whether it's a same TV show that we like to watch or going and doing fun things, game night, that sort of thing. So I think our kids need to see us modeling that. As you said, that we want to belong. We want to be part of their lives, and that's okay.

Hillary: 24:48

I love that. So what happens? What changes when kids feel like they belong, when we feel like we belong,

Unknown: 24:57

I think we get a greater. Sense of trust, and I think inclusion or belonging in our circles a greater confidence right to speak up on concerns that we may have, or even a greater confidence to share the positives too, right? I think that's something that I personally struggle with. Right? Is sharing, okay? Yeah, they want to hear about my my good stuff that's going on too. They care, right? So I think that's something that we can model, you know, as adults to kiddos as well. I think that the biggest thing that we can do is continue to encourage kids to strive. We were talking before we came on that Angela Duckworth had a great TED Talk about a study that they did to determine success in life. They tested kids at Harvard and at West Point and Boeing and University of Michigan and wherever Harvard all over the place to determine, well, was it that? Did you go to preschool? Is that the determining factor your IQ or or did you live here or there, whatever? And the greatest determiner of success in life was grit, the unwavering dedication to an objective or some goal. And so our jobs as adults are to help kids and help people develop grit. It's not the easiest thing in the world to do, because oftentimes life pushes you down and then pushes you down again, and then pushes you down repeatedly to the point where you've kind of given up. But our whole goal is to help kids understand that they are the masters of their universe, and they're the ones who are going to determine what happens for the rest of their lives, the things that have happened to them in the past, especially when we're dealing with kids who have trauma and adults who have trauma, is that those events don't have to define them. They obviously are part of what's making them who they are, but they can move beyond that. And so I think that helping people develop grit, helping young people develop grit, so they have that in their older life, as they start to mature, is critically important to make sure that they can find happiness and figure out that okay, this may not be what I started out doing, but I love this, and I want to keep doing it, so I think that's what keeps us doing the kind of work that we do. Yeah, and hearing that, though, I also think of like, care for the caregiver and making sure that they have their own grit. And, you know when, when, you know, adolescents give them their own troubles. Yeah? Because, like, we have all men give us troubles. You know, we're all babies just going through new environments, right? Um, our caregivers are people that we have deemed supports able to continue to hold our hands and guide us through that, and I think that that's an important aspect that I like with wraparound or even at the services here at Wedgwood, we're always checking in with caregivers as well. I think

Hillary: 27:54

when you talk about developing grit too, I have not heard this TED talk, but it will be adding it to my list. I imagine that it's near impossible to develop grit on your own, like you probably need somebody there to help you, because, like you said, life will knock you down and then again and again, and after a while, it gets a little hard to get up on your own. And so having somebody there who can help pick you back up, help keep you going, dust you off, try again is important. So same thing with caregivers. You know you need a support. Need somewhere where you know you can open up and be vulnerable and say, Hey, I'm really struggling. And feel like it's okay for me to say that here, yes,

Unknown: 28:34

yeah, absolutely. Whether, whether you find other people to confide in, or you journal, I journal all the time, walk the dog, go out and do things bake. I love people who love to bake. I love to bake. And it's those sorts of things that'll that'll keep you moving forward, because it's true. So many people in the work that we do get burned out and get burned out very, very quickly, because it's so all encompassing, and you have to make sure that you take care of yourself, or you take care of the other people around you. Because when we do Child Protective work, there are the case managers, there are the therapists, there are the wraparound folks, there's the Community Living supports, there's the parent to parent mentors. I mean, it's literally, you have the village right in court with us when we have our hearings, and it's all these people who are pouring themselves into these families and trying to help them make these better choices and to make their lives better so we can reunify these kids. And it's and it's huge, difficult work, but so affirming when it works, and even sometimes when it doesn't work, and we find new forever families for these kids. You have to understand that, okay, there's only so much grief that we can absorb in our. Lives, and we have to find good ways to handle that, so otherwise, we end up not being able to give to feed into others, to feed that positivity into others.

Hillary: 30:13

So I always like to make sure that these coffee breaks are hopeful and helpful. So for this hopeful piece, what gives you hope when it comes to helping children finding belonging,

Unknown: 30:27

I like hearing the stories that the kids are still wanting to be accepted, wanting to join a circle, even if it is done in the wrong way, whereas maybe they join the wrong circle, get themselves in trouble. I love the fact that they are still willing, because then that is an energy that we can redirect and just guide in a more positive way. Yes, I'm Yes. I like working with kiddos. Unfortunately, are more isolated, right? But I it's in those situations where we need to grow their their determination and in allowing themselves to explore and get more involved with other circles too. I think kids naturally have hopes and dreams and aspirations, and if you can find out from them what those hopes and dreams and aspirations are, and say, Okay, what can we do? How can we develop a plan to help you with this? It's awesome, because then it helps them to see beyond just today, yeah, I think kids are a lot more informed today about what's going on in the world, what's going on internationally, what's going on with the environment, what's going on politically. And that's a lot for a developing brain to try to handle. It's a lot for an adult brain to try and handle Absolutely, absolutely. And so if we can try to keep them focused and develop that grit, it's hard, it's really, really hard to do, but that connection, whether you're the one who's connected to them, or you find somebody else who's really into that, and make sure that you're encouraging that sort of a connection. And it could be just going to a game night with like, once a month with people, and that might be what it is, or working with kids, or finding a way to do it, or volunteering. I love volunteers. I mean, talk about your giving, and you're receiving so much, whether it's, you know, doing the rough readers at the library, or I've got a West Michigan therapy dog, and that's just, it's so tremendously engaging, because there's people loving on your dog, and it's just making them feel so good, and it's making you feel so good that you're helping them to feel so good. And it's those sort of things. So I just these kids have their whole lives ahead of them, then we just have to help them become the best that they can be, and let them realize that they might have dreams now that might be different dreams next week, that may be different dreams next year, but that's okay, and we'll just support them and find new ways that we connect them. So, yeah, no, I think the important part is like that A dream is kept alive. Yeah, right. And it doesn't matter if it changes from day to day, like you mentioned, but it's again, having that determination, you know, just to keep, keep aspiring for something different, for something better than what you're finding yourself in right now. I love

Hillary: 33:25

that. And so for the helpful piece, what are some strategies to foster a stronger sense of belonging and confidence in kids and maybe even ourselves?

Unknown: 33:34

I think just getting involved in community and events helping kids figure out, okay, what are the three things that you think you'd like to investigate, whether it's volunteering pieces or art or sports or whatever that might be, book reading, going to the library, getting in a book club, and then trying to say, okay, how can we make this work with your schedule? Because kids are really overbooked these days too, and how can we kind of get you off your devices and get you out in the world and meaningful ways? So for the most part, that's a difficult thing to do with with our kids in general, I think because they're so dependent on that, I'm really hoping that schools, and I know people are going to not like this very much, there's a push to keep cells phones out of schools, and I'm a big fan in the old days, if our parents need to get a hold of us or there's an emergency, they'd contact the principal's office, they come and find us, but definitely out of out of middle schools and elementary schools, and then limit their ability to be available while they're in high schools. Yeah, teachers have a very hard job to try to engage kids and get their minds focused when kids are still Doom scrolling in class and things like that. But yeah, we just have to be creative. We have to continue to think, okay, how can we how can we help? How can we inspire? How can we develop that grit? Yeah, and I think using technology and social media. To our advantage, to and recognizing that it does play a really big part in a lot of kiddos roles. I recently worked with a rap kiddo that, you know, he had a whole Roblox community, you know. And you know, instantly when I think of Roblox like, Oh, I just think of all the risks, you know, the dangers that could accompany it, right? But he just the light that shone on his face when he started talking about his best friend that he taught. That he talks with every day online, but maybe not, you know, physically, because he lives in the other side of the state, and what they in their friendship were able to accomplish and build and Roblox and in Minecraft was amazing, you know. And so I think not dismissing like kiddos ideas of what they inspire to I think earlier we mentioned, okay, well, my environment and my experience grew up, led me to like these interests. Well, a lot of interest now for kiddos is technology, you know, and so kind of taking that and, you know, running with it in a positive way.

Hillary: 35:58

I like that. You phrase it as using it to our advantage that it's a tool, like, there can be a lot of good in it if there are some guide rails and some other external supports to go with it. But yeah, that's super cool that that kid had a online community already

Unknown: 36:14

well. And, like I said, because we were so isolated for so long, that's how kids developed, and that's okay, as long as, like you said, there's some guidelines in there. And, you know, as parents, we could say, okay, you know, when you're with these groups, here's the sorts of things that we need to look out for. And it's amazing how kids will say, you know, Mom, I got off that group because they were doing this and that. And the other thing I said, you know, that was a really good choice. And hopefully you'll be able to find other groups that do the same sorts of things, as far as your activities that you like that aren't engaging in that sort of behavior, because that's not helpful for anybody. Yeah, yeah. But like in those situations too, it's like the confidence right, that the kiddo has in their parent to share something that you know it may be a little sketchy, right? Kudos to the parent right for fostering that relationship and that trust with their kid, where they felt safe to say, Yeah, I need to find another group of friends.

Hillary: 37:06

I think it almost goes back to the stat I shared at the beginning, where most kids don't feel like they belong at school, and social media and online communities can often be a source where they can connect with people that have interests that maybe their friends at school don't. So it's not, you know, all bad, but it you know, like everything in moderation,

Unknown: 37:28

that's true. You know, our kids have really unique interests and unique things that capture their imagination, that I don't think we had access to a lot of things, because it was just what's in your community and what's right here and what's in your house. And they have, they have access to everything in the world, all the people in the world, which is kind of scary, and all the things in the world, but hopefully positive things. Yeah,

Hillary: 37:54

this is such good insight. I loved being able to take this coffee break with you both today. So thank you so much that you could be here. Thank you. It's a pleasure. Thank you. And if a child in your life, or you yourself are really struggling with a sense of belonging, no, you are not alone. Wedgwood is a place where healing begins with understanding, acceptance and hope. Learn more and get connected to our team at Wedgwood org, slash counseling. All the info will be linked in the episode description. Stay hopeful, stay helpful, and let's have another coffee break soon. You.